Hannity Hate Speech Sure to Grow as Obama Reaches Out to Muslims

06 April 2009 10:27 am by Taylor Marsh


Barack Hussein Obama in today does what no other American president could do by virtue of his background and who he is. But the sheer act alone of reaching out to this Muslim nation is certain to drive the Hannity hate speech crowd to further ends of division and derision.

Even as a new poll shows Americans ready to turn the page from the past, the Hannity haters have driven a wedge between even moderate Muslims and American reality, sewing doubt about a faith using ignorance and fear to get the job done.

Most Americans think President Obama’s pledge to “seek a new way forward” with the Muslim world is an important goal, even as nearly half hold negative views about Islam and a sizable number say that even mainstream adherents to the encourage violence against non-Muslims, according to a new Washington Post-ABC News poll.

There is still a broad lack of familiarity with the world’s second-largest — 55 percent of those polled said they are without a basic understanding of the teachings and beliefs of Islam, and most said they do not know anyone who is Muslim. While awareness has increased in recent years, underlying views have not improved.

About half, 48 percent, said they have an unfavorable view of Islam, the highest in polls since late 2001. Nearly three in 10, or 29 percent, said they see mainstream Islam as advocating violence against non-Muslims; although more, 58 percent, said it is a peaceful .

Muslims make up about 1 percent of all U.S. adults. [...]

President Obama’s full remarks are below, which address , but also ’s 1915 stain, going as well into the issue of Middle East peace. Even in the face of our own country not being quite sure about those of Muslim faith around the world, led by the fearmongering Hannity haters, Obama’s words and presidency provide a path. It will take a lot more than this speech to get the bridge done.

Mr. Speaker, Madam Deputy Speaker, distinguished members, I am honored to speak in this chamber, and I am committed to renewing the alliance between our nations and the friendship between our people.

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This is my first trip overseas as President of the United States. I have been to the G-20 Summit in London, the NATO Summit in Strasbourg and Kehl, and the European Union Summit in Prague. Some people have asked me if I chose to continue my travels to Ankara and Istanbul to send a message. My answer is simple: Evet. is a critical ally. is an important part of Europe. And and the United States must stand together – and work together – to overcome the challenges of our time.

This morning I had the privilege of visiting the tomb of the great founder of your Republic. I was deeply impressed by this beautiful memorial to a man who did so much to shape the course of history. But it is also clear that the greatest monument to Ataturk’s life is not something that can be cast in stone and marble. His greatest legacy is ’s strong and secular democracy, and that is the work that this assembly carries on today.

This future was not easily assured. At the end of World War I, could have succumbed to the foreign powers that were trying to claim its territory, or sought to restore an ancient empire. But chose a different future. You freed yourself from foreign control. And you founded a Republic that commands the respect of the United States and the wider world.

There is a simple truth to this story: ’s democracy is your own achievement. It was not forced upon you by any outside power, nor did it come without struggle and sacrifice. Like any democracy, draws strength from both the successes of the past, and from the efforts of each generation of Turks that makes new progress for your people.

My country’s democracy has its own story. The general who led America in revolution and governed as our first President was George Washington. Like you, we built a grand monument to honor our founding father – a towering obelisk that stands in the heart of the capital city that bears Washington’s name.

It took decades to build. There were frequent delays. Over time, more and more people contributed to help make this monument the inspiring structure that still stands tall today. Among those who came to our aid were friends from all across the world, who offered their own tributes to Washington and the country he helped to found.

One of those tributes came from Istanbul. Ottoman Sultan Abdulmecid sent a marble plaque that helped to build the Washington Monument. Inscribed in the plaque was a poem that began with a few simple words, and I quote: “So as to strengthen the friendship between the two countries.” Over 150 years have passed since those words were carved into marble. Our nations have changed in many ways. But our friendship is strong, and our alliance endures.

It is a friendship that flourished in the years after World War II, when President Truman committed our nation to the defense of ’s freedom and sovereignty, and committed itself to the NATO alliance. Turkish troops have served by our side from Korea to Kosovo to Kabul. Together, we withstood the great test of the Cold War. Trade between our nations has steadily advanced. So has cooperation in science and research.

The ties among our people have deepened as well, and more and more Americans of Turkish origin live and work and succeed within our borders. As a basketball fan, I’ve even noticed that Hedo Turkoglu and Mehmet Okur have got some pretty good game.

The United States and have not always agreed on every issue. That is to be expected – no two nations do. But we have stood together through many challenges over the last sixty years. And because of the strength of our alliance and the endurance of our friendship, both America and are stronger, and the world is more secure.

Now, our two democracies are confronted by an unprecedented set of challenges. An economic crisis that recognizes no borders. Extremism that leads to the killing of innocent men, women and children. Strains on our energy supply and a changing climate. The proliferation of the world’s deadliest weapons, and the persistence of tragic conflict.

These are the great tests of our young century. And the choices that we make in the coming years will determine whether the future will be shaped by fear or by freedom; by poverty or by prosperity; by strife or by a just, secure and lasting peace.

This much is certain: no one nation can confront these challenges alone, and all nations have a stake in overcoming them. That is why we must listen to one another, and seek common ground. That is why we must build on our mutual interests, and rise above our differences. We are stronger when we act together. That is the message that I have carried with me throughout this trip to Europe. That will be the approach of the United States of America going forward.

Already, America and are working with the G-20 on an unprecedented response to an unprecedented economic crisis. This past week, we came together to ensure that the world’s largest economies take strong and coordinated action to stimulate growth and restore the flow of credit; to reject the pressure of protectionism, and to extend a hand to developing countries and the people hit hardest by this downturn; and to dramatically reform our regulatory system so that the world never faces a crisis like this again.

As we go forward, the United States and can pursue many opportunities to serve prosperity for our people, particularly when it comes to energy. To expand markets and create jobs, we can increase trade and investment between our countries. To develop new sources of energy and combat climate change, we should build on our Clean Technology Fund to leverage efficiency and renewable energy investments in . And to power markets in and Europe, the United States will continue to support your central role as an East-West corridor for oil and natural gas.

This economic cooperation only reinforces the common security that Europe and the United States share with as a NATO ally, and the common values that we share as democracies. So in meeting the challenges of the 21st century, we must seek the strength of a Europe that is truly united, peaceful and free.

Let me be clear: the United States strongly supports ’s bid to become a member of the European Union. We speak not as members of the EU, but as close friends of and Europe. has been a resolute ally and a responsible partner in transatlantic and European institutions. And is bound to Europe by more than bridges over the Bosphorous. Centuries of shared history, culture, and commerce bring you together. Europe gains by diversity of ethnicity, tradition and faith – it is not diminished by it. And Turkish membership would broaden and strengthen Europe’s foundation once more.

has its own responsibilities. You have made important progress toward membership. But I also know that has pursued difficult political reforms not simply because it’s good for Europe, but because it is right for .

In the last several years, you have abolished state-security courts and expanded the right to counsel. You have reformed the penal code, and strengthened laws that govern the freedom of the press and assembly. You lifted bans on teaching and broadcasting Kurdish, and the world noted with respect the important signal sent through a new state Kurdish television station.

These achievements have created new laws that must be implemented, and a momentum that should be sustained. For democracies cannot be static – they must move forward. Freedom of and expression lead to a strong and vibrant civil society that only strengthens the state, which is why steps like reopening the Halki Seminary will send such an important signal inside and beyond. An enduring commitment to the rule of law is the only way to achieve the security that comes from justice for all people. Robust minority rights let societies benefit from the full measure of contributions from all citizens.

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I say this as the President of a country that not too long ago made it hard for someone who looks like me to vote. But it is precisely that capacity to change that enriches our countries. Every challenge that we face is more easily met if we tend to our own democratic foundation. This work is never over. That is why, in the United States, we recently ordered the prison at Guantanamo Bay closed, and prohibited – without exception or equivocation – any use of .

Another issue that confronts all democracies as they move to the future is how we deal with the past. The United States is still working through some of our own darker periods. Facing the Washington monument that I spoke of is a memorial to Abraham Lincoln, the man who freed those who were enslaved even after Washington led our Revolution. And our country still struggles with the legacy of our past treatment of Native Americans.

Human endeavor is by its nature imperfect. History, unresolved, can be a heavy weight. Each country must work through its past. And reckoning with the past can help us seize a better future. I know there are strong views in this chamber about the terrible events of 1915. While there has been a good deal of commentary about my views, this is really about how the Turkish and Armenian people deal with the past. And the best way forward for the Turkish and Armenian people is a process that works through the past in a way that is honest, open and constructive.

We have already seen historic and courageous steps taken by Turkish and Armenian leaders. These contacts hold out the promise of a new day. An open border would return the Turkish and Armenian people to a peaceful and prosperous coexistence that would serve both of your nations. That is why the United States strongly supports the full normalization of relations between and Armenia.

It speaks to ’s leadership that you are poised to be the only country in the region to have normal and peaceful relations with all the South Caucusus nations. And to advance that peace, you can play a constructive role in helping to resolve the Nagorno-Karabakh conflict, which has continued for far too long.

Advancing peace also includes the dispute that persists in the eastern Mediterranean. Here, there is cause for hope. The two Cypriot leaders have an opportunity through their commitment to negotiations under the United Nations Good Offices Mission. The United States is willing to offer all the help sought by the parties as they work toward a just and lasting settlement that reunifies Cyprus into a bizonal and bicommunal federation.

These efforts speak to one part of the critical region that surrounds . And when we consider the challenges before us, on issue after issue, we share common goals.

In the Middle East, we share the goal of a lasting peace between Israel and its neighbors. Let me be clear: the United States strongly supports the goal of two states, Israel and Palestine, living side by side in peace and security. That is a goal shared by Palestinians, Israelis, and people of good will around the world. That is a goal that that the parties agreed to in the Roadmap and at Annapolis. And that is a goal that I will actively pursue as President.

We know that the road ahead will be difficult. Both Israelis and Palestinians must take the steps that are necessary to build confidence. Both must live up to the commitments they have made. Both must overcome longstanding passions and the politics of the moment to make progress toward a secure and lasting peace.

The United States and can help the Palestinians and Israelis make this journey. Like the United States, has been a friend and partner in Israel’s quest for security. And like the United States, you seek a future of opportunity and statehood for the Palestinians. Now, we must not give into pessimism and mistrust. We must pursue every opportunity for progress, as you have done by supporting negotiations between Syria and Israel. We must extend a hand to those Palestinians who are in need, while helping them strengthen institutions. And we must reject the use of terror, and recognize that Israel’s security concerns are legitimate.

The peace of the region will also be advanced if Iran forgoes any nuclear weapons ambitions. As I made clear yesterday in Prague, no one is served by the spread of nuclear weapons. This part of the world has known enough violence. It has known enough hatred. It does not need a race for ever-more powerful tools of destruction.

I have made it clear to the people and leaders of the Islamic Republic that the United States seeks engagement based upon mutual interests and mutual respect. We want Iran to play its rightful role in the community of nations, with the economic and political integration that brings prosperity and security. Now, Iran’s leaders must choose whether they will try to build a weapon or build a better future for their people.

Both and the United States support a secure and united Iraq that does not serve as a safe-haven for terrorists. I know there were differences about whether to go to war. There were differences within my own country as well. But now we must come together as we end this war responsibly, because the future of Iraq is inseparable from the future of the broader region. The United States will remove our combat brigades by the end of next August, while working with the Iraqi government as they take responsibility for security. And we will work with Iraq, , and all of Iraq’s neighbors, to forge a new dialogue that reconciles differences and advances our common security.

Make no mistake, though: Iraq, , and the United States face a common threat from terrorism. That includes the al Qaeda terrorists who have sought to drive Iraqis apart and to destroy their country. And that includes the PKK. There is no excuse for terror against any nation. As President, and as a NATO ally, I pledge that you will have our support against the terrorist activities of the PKK. These efforts will be strengthened by the continued work to build ties of cooperation between , the Iraqi government, and Iraq’s Kurdish leaders, and by your continued efforts to promote education and opportunity for ’s Kurds.

Finally, we share the common goal of denying al Qaeda a safe-haven in Pakistan or Afghanistan. The world has come too far to let this region backslide, and to let al Qaeda terrorists plot further attacks. That is why we are committed to a more focused effort to disrupt, dismantle, and defeat al Qaeda. That is why we are increasing our efforts to train Afghans to sustain their own security, and to reconcile former adversaries. And that is why we are increasing our support for the people of Afghanistan and Pakistan, so that we stand on the side of their security, their opportunity, and the promise of a better life.

has been a true partner. Your troops were among the first in the International Security Assistance Force. You have sacrificed much in this endeavor. Now, we must achieve our goals together. I appreciate that you have offered to help us train and support Afghan Security Forces, and expand opportunity across the region. Together, we can rise to meet this challenge like we have so many before.

I know there have been difficulties these last few years. I know that the trust that binds us has been strained, and I know that strain is shared in many places where the Muslim faith is practiced. Let me say this as clearly as I can: the United States is not at war with Islam. In fact, our partnership with the Muslim world is critical in rolling back a fringe ideology that people of all faiths reject.

But I also want to be clear that America’s relationship with the Muslim work cannot and will not be based on opposition to al Qaeda. Far from it. We seek broad engagement based upon mutual interests and mutual respect. We will listen carefully, bridge misunderstanding, and seek common ground. We will be respectful, even when we do not agree. And we will convey our deep appreciation for the Islamic faith, which has done so much over so many centuries to shape the world for the better – including my own country. The United States has been enriched by Muslim Americans. Many other Americans have Muslims in their family, or have lived in a Muslim-majority country – I know, because I am one of them.

Above all, we will demonstrate through actions our commitment to a better future. We want to help more children get the education that they need to succeed. We want to promote health care in places where people are vulnerable. We want to expand the trade and investment that can bring prosperity for all people. In the months ahead, I will present specific programs to advance these goals. Our focus will be on what we can do, in partnership with people across the Muslim world, to advance our common hopes, and our common dreams. And when people look back on this time, let it be said of America that we extended the hand of friendship.

There is an old Turkish proverb: “You cannot put out fire with flames.”

America knows this. knows this. There are some who must be met with force. But force alone cannot solve our problems, and it is no alternative to extremism. The future must belong to those who create, not those who destroy. That is the future we must work for, and we must work for it together.

I know there are those who like to debate ’s future. They see your country at the crossroads of continents, and touched by the currents of history. They know that this has been a place where civilizations meet, and different peoples mingle. And they wonder whether you will be pulled in one direction or another.

Here is what they don’t understand: ’s greatness lies in your ability to be at the center of things. This is not where East and West divide – it is where they come together. In the beauty of your culture. In the richness of your history. In the strength of your democracy. In your hopes for tomorrow.

I am honored to stand here with you – to look forward to the future that we must reach for together – and to reaffirm America’s commitment to our strong and enduring friendship. Thank you.

 
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49 Responses to “Hannity Hate Speech Sure to Grow as Obama Reaches Out to Muslims”

  1. angels81 says:

    The wing nut hate machine will jump all over this as more proof that the President is a secret Muslim. They will scream that Obama is selling out America to terrorists, which will fire up the loony right wing nut jobs to more extreme actions. This little speech in Turkey today will be a boom for gun sales in this country with the wing nut crowd. This will be the legacy that the wing nut hate machine will give us.

  2. djjl says:

    What am I missing – I didn’t read anything in that speech that was fodder for the wingnuts. I’ll read it again.

  3. Jane Austen says:

    “There is an old Turkish proverb: “You cannot put out fire with flames.”

    America knows this. Turkey knows this. There are some who must be met with force. But force alone cannot solve our problems, and it is no alternative to extremism. The future must belong to those who create, not those who destroy. That is the future we must work for, and we must work for it together.”

    Taylor – I think this is what Obama has been driving home over and over again. And it is especially meaningful during this week of Holy Week. We can only hope and pray that it does not fall on deaf ears.

    A bit off topic – I have been to Turkey 3 times; the most memorable was when I visited the Topkapi Palace in Istanbul and climbed up on a ledge to get a better view of an icon, I think only to fall when coming off the ledge. I broke my ankle. I received excellent care in the Turkish ER but I also received a resounding scolding from the curator of the museum, much deserved, especially in light of the sign that said in several lauguages, including English, “Do not walk past the barrier.” I came home on crutches.

  4. Jane Austen says:

    I don’t see anything the wingnuts could jump all over except in their deluded fantasies. They just can’t move on, can I?

  5. Taylor Marsh says:

    It’s not the speech, djjl, it’s the act of reaching out to Muslims, while also admitting to torture, etc. It doesn’t take much to inspire the Hannity hate speech crowd.

    Love the anecdote, JA, which is very much on topic, actually.

    Yes, the holy week timeline meant something to me, too.

  6. Jane Austen says:

    meant to write…can they?

  7. Taylor Marsh says:

    Nope, they’re going to campaign on it.

  8. Jane Austen says:

    Well if they intend to campaign on it it’s going to sound like a broken record and you know what you do with a broken record, right?

  9. Jane Austen says:

    BBL.

  10. djjl says:

    I’m not so sure the ignorance which allowed the wrong/right wing to flourish is still as prevalent. This country has learned a bitter lesson about indifference to policy and ignorance of the grounds on which those policies were made.

    Fool me once, shame of you.
    Fool me twice, shame on me………..

    “it’s hard to dance with the devil on your back….”

  11. djjl says:

    Well, I think President Obama, as Christian, has likely asked himself – WWJD. And he’s proceeding accordingly.

    Reminds me of 1992 when a friend asked how I could possibly consider voting for Bill Clinton. I told her it was very easy – I thought – “what would Jesus do.”

  12. angels81 says:

    Hannity and the rabid hate machine have a fair sized following. Gun sales in this country are way up, and the main reason given by most buyers is, Obama is going to take our guns away. These hate mongers influence a lot of people out there, and they must be taken seriously.

  13. AnninCA says:

    Hannity squawks, but then he’s like Rush. The name of the game is to fire everything up into a big deal to drive up ratings.

    In reality, Obama’s remarks are very similar to Bush’s, so I can’t picture how this will exactly work out as a campaign item.

  14. AnninCA says:

    angel…..I was pretty shocked the other night as liberal bloggers discussed how they absolutely carry guns.

    I don’t think this is merely a conservative deal. We seem to be into some kind of fear deal, where people think arming themselves is smart.

    Frankly, I’ll never get it.

  15. angels81 says:

    AnninCA, that may be true, but I know very few liberal’s who are buying guns because they think Obama is going to take all our guns away.

  16. djjl says:

    http://alexa.com/siteinfo/hannity.com

    Hopefully this trend will continue.

  17. AnninCA says:

    It’s hard to discern motives, of course. I know gun sales and home safe sales skyrocketed at the beginning of the financial crisis.

  18. PissedOffAmerican says:

    Well, have we already forgotten that George Bush described Islam as a “religion of peace”, and a good part of his early PR efforts in selling this scam known as the GWOT were devoted to claiming that “this is not a war on Muslims”?

    As George Bush and the satanic monster Dick Cheney so clearly demonstrated, words are not sufficient if the deeds do not match the words.

    There is plenty in Obama’s actual policies that will carry far more import with the Muslim global community than platitudes and eloquent oration. Of course, foremost in the minds of the Muslim community, when trying to find sincerity in Obama’s speech, will be how he deals with the Israelis and the Palestinians. And thus far, he shows no inclination to change the dynamic, the rhetoric, or our policies of subsidizing and supporting the actions of Israel, no matter how egregious or criminal. It is truly ludicrous to think that Obama can stand before the world community and promise a fresh relatiuonship with the Muslim community and be taken seriously if our relationship with Israel is maintained at the status quo. Israel’s recent war crimes committed in Gaza illicited silence from the Obama camp, as did Lieberman’s public disavowal of a two state solution. Meanwhile, both Netanyahu and Liebermnan have made no secret of their intention to continue settlement expansion. The Obama response? A tepid statement from Clinton about settlement expansion being “unhelpful”. To think that the Muslim community will place more wieght on Obama’s words than his actual policies is naive. They do not live in a vacuum, and have had close to nine years of hateful rhetoric through which to form a strong foundation of distrust.

    The second arena that will be closely watched by the Muslim community is Iran, and whether or not Israel will dictate our policies, rhetoric, and agenda. So far, again, Obama’s words about diplomatic engagement with Iran have been encouraging. Yet on the other hand, he has used the same rhetoric as the Israelis to exagerate the threat and the scope of Iran’s nuclear program, takling his words almost ver batim from the Israeli propaganda machine. Again, such a dichotomy is surely noted by the global Muslim community.

    My pessimism here is grounded in no small part by the ACTUAL WORDS AND ACTIONS of Barack Obama. So too is Taylor’s optimism. Only history will reconcile which face Obama was sincere in revealing. But you can be sure the Muslim world is watching through a microscope, and they EXPECT empty words from us. I hope Obama dissappoints them in this expectation.

  19. AnninCA says:

    The next great cultural divide issue? I had lunch this weekend with two women from Iran. They were telling me that in Germany, they are treated suspiciously…until they identify as Iranians. Why the poor treatment? They are profiled as Turks. As soon as THAT is cleared up, Germans smile broadly and all is well.

    The reason, according to my friends, is because Iranians in Germany have adapted to the language, etc., while the Turks have not.

    Gee, this reminds me a lot of prejudice everywhere.

    I guess some stuff is universal.

  20. angels81 says:

    Taylor, it sure didn’t take the wing nuts long to jump on what the President said in Turkey did it? Just reading some of the comments on Malkins site tells you were the wing nuts are going to go with this. We need to take these people seriously. We may have seen one effect to all the right wing hate speech this weekend in Pitts.

  21. djjl says:

    AnninCa

    This happened here a couple weeks ago. This wasn’t far from my home. Only a short distance from my daughter’s apartment.

    http://www.nwanews.com/adg/National/255678/print/

    The Antonetz’s attend church with us. I do know that he supported Obama. He’s a public health dentist for the VA.

  22. Jane Austen says:

    angels81 says:
    06 April 2009 at 11:34 am

    ________

    What Malkin and her ilk fail to realize is that they are just as bad as the fringe elements of Islam.

  23. djjl says:

    JA

    My guess is that Malkin is no different from Limbaugh, Hannity, etc. They are not in this based on principle – they are willing to prostitute themselves for the money. I think that is called a whore. Of the lowest form – it’s not like they are doing it to survive. They do it because they don’t mind whoring.

  24. GeoT says:

    “But the sheer act alone of reaching out to this Muslim nation is certain to drive the Hannity hate speech crowd to further ends of division and derision.” tm.com
    ____

    I say let ‘em go full steam ahead. The clearer the delineation between Hannity’s crowd and those of us who want engagement and progress in our foreign policy the better. Jim Baker, no shrinking violet of a liberal was on GPS with Fareed Zacharia and he spoke very favorably about this administration policies. His quote “you make peace with your enemies, not your friends. …”
    _______

    Foreign Policy: Jim Baker gives Obama high marks

    http://www.examiner.com/x-2086-NY-Foreign-Policy-Examiner~y2009m4d5-Foreign-Policy-Jim-Baker-gives-Obama-high-marks

  25. Jane Austen says:

    or perverting the truth if they even understand what truth is.

  26. ogenec says:

    Well, per my usual plaint, I believe that it’s not just the Right that needs to re-orient its attitude towards the Muslim world. The Left does as well. And I think Obama was speaking to both sets of extremists. The Right is wrong to regard all Muslims as terrorists. And the Left is wrong to insist on wholesale adoption of Western cultural values. Ironically, if that attitude persists, it will hasten the demise of the moderate, secular elements in Muslim countries such as Turkey and Iran.

    EVERYBODY should STFU and let these countries work things out for themselves, without outside interference of any political stripe. That, I think, is what Obama means when he says “There is a simple truth to this story: Turkey’s democracy is your own achievement. It was not forced upon you by any outside power, nor did it come without struggle and sacrifice.”

  27. djjl says:

    “AnninCA says:
    06 April 2009 at 11:09 am

    In reality, Obama’s remarks are very similar to Bush’s, so I can’t picture how this will exactly work out as a campaign item.”

    The real difference is the credibility of who is making the remarks. As I’ve said previously, if W told be 2 + = 4 , I’d pull out a calculator.

  28. djjl says:

    ogenec is right.

    Hannity and ilk, again are not into discussing any of this with any concern about principle or policy – it’s about keeping their audience entertained.

  29. djjl says:

    Let me try that again ;-)

    28.
    djjl says:
    06 April 2009 at 12:11 pm

    “AnninCA says:
    06 April 2009 at 11:09 am

    In reality, Obama’s remarks are very similar to Bush’s, so I can’t picture how this will exactly work out as a campaign item.”

    The real difference is the credibility of who is making the remarks. As I’ve said previously, if W told me 2 + 2= 4 , I’d pull out a calculator.

  30. Jane Austen says:

    AnninCA says:
    06 April 2009 at 11:32 am

    _______

    There’s a whole history of the Turks in Germany beginning in the 1960s when Germany needed workers and allowed the Turks to come in and work. It’s not a pretty history and a lot of prejudice surrounds the German/Turkish relationship. Until recently children born in Germany to Turkish parents were not granted citizenship. At some point in the mid to 1980s I believe the German government tried to deport Turks who had lived in Germany for many years including those who had been born there. Like I said it’s not a pretty history and rather convolluted.

  31. Taylor Marsh says:

    fyi… From the White House:

    The President will meet with religious leaders in Istanbul tomorrow morning. Following the meeting, he will tour the Hagia Sophia and the Blue Mosque with Prime Minister Erdogan. The Hagia Sophia, or Aya Sofya was formerly a basilica, then a mosque, and now a museum that is considered an embodiment of Byzantine architecture. Completed in 537, it was the world’s largest religious monument until 1520.

    The Sultan Ahmed Mosque, also known as the Blue Mosque, is one of Istanbul’s most famous landmarks and is the national mosque of Turkey. It is located in the heart of old town, facing the Hagia Sophia. The Blue Mosque was built by Sultan Ahmet I between 1609 and 1616 in Sultanahmet Square. It is called the Blue Mosque because of the thousands of hand-painted Iznik tiles that adorn its interior.

    In the afternoon, the President will hold a town hall with students at the Tophane Cultural Center. The majority of participating students, ranging in age from eighteen to twenty-six, are from universities across the country including international students from Kosovo, Korea and Albania currently studying in Turkey. The remaining students are former participants of US State Department programs, including the Student Leader Program, Fulbright, Youth Exchange Study (YES), Youth Exchange Program (YEP) and the Summer Work & Travel program.

    Later in the afternoon, President Obama will depart Istanbul for Washington, DC, returning in the evening. The arrival on the South Lawn is open press.

  32. Jane Austen says:

    djjl says:
    06 April 2009 at 12:04 pm

    _________

    But you will admit they have to have a starting point for their rants and I think that that whole bunch come from a very slanted and perverted world view thinking.

  33. GeoT says:

    update from planet Bachmann:

    U.S. Rep. Michele Bachmann says she fears the Obama Administration will set up “re-education camps for young people, where young people have to go and get trained in a philosophy that the government puts forward…

    http://minnesotaindependent.com/31237/bachmann-reedcuation-camps

  34. Jane Austen says:

    GeoT says:
    06 April 2009 at 1:06 pm

    update from planet Bachmann:

    ______

    She’s either off her meds or hasn’t seen her therapist in awhile. What is wrong with people like her? Are they living in some parallel universe? I couldn’t think like that in a million years.

  35. GeoT says:

    Jane Austen says:
    06 April 2009 at 1:10 pm

    GeoT says:
    06 April 2009 at 1:06 pm

    update from planet Bachmann:

    ______

    She’s either off her meds or hasn’t seen her therapist in awhile.
    ______

    when you’re in league with Hannity and Beck you have to be louder and crazier than the next guy I guess.

  36. Iceblinkjm says:

    Wonder if the White House or the State Dept. is aware of what our “allies” in Iraq are up too.

    http://www.queerty.com/americas-lgbt-community-must-support-iraqs-gays-lesbians-20090405/

    I am not really seeing much of a difference between Bush and Obama when it comes to this issue. Folks are still being murdered. Maybe they don’t deserve my tax dollars any longer.

  37. Lake Lady says:

    I love Obama’s way of reaching out to the rest of the world.I love that he admits that we are not perfect and that all countries consider themselves to be exceptional.In this respect he is the perfect man for the times.The United States seems to be heading in a direction in the view of the rest of the world of diminished importance and influence. Other players are rising up and we do need to “reset” our relationships. We can’t afford “empire” any more and our kind of capitalism is showing it’s weaknesses to the world.

  38. AnninCA says:

    Jane….totally fascinating tidbit there. I thoroughly enjoy all these glimpses into other cultural prejudices.

    There was a fascinating author last night on John Bachelor who gives a thorough history of the Darfor region. He has a much less stereotypical view, of course.

  39. AnninCA says:

    dj…..I don’t think there was ever any doubt that we were not at war with all Muslims, whether Bush was liked or not.

    I “think” the point the right-wing radio guys are making is that Obama is sounding like an apologist.

    BTW, the British press is ripping him today, too. The articles are on RCP. (They think he’s long-winded and a bit of a bore.) :)

  40. Lake Lady says:

    Gates is on MSNBC now talking about plans to change military spending….

  41. djjl says:

    The right wing apologist may just be another’s honest realist.

  42. AnninCA says:

    I like Gates. His ideas made sense to me. Of course, what I understand about the military is zip, really.

    But….it sounded logical.

  43. AnninCA says:

    The conservatives hate apologists, always have. They are fiercely passionate on that point.

    What’s fascinating today is that a lot of those same ideas have migrated now to the left. They are fiercely passionate about not allowing the usual crud with this presidency. (No Obama fingers allowed, even in Germany!) Also, buy American has become fashionable again. And the big doo-dah over KOS comments about how conservatives are those who buy guns and kill people is another example of gross generalizations being “in” right now.

    It’s an interesting time we live in. We’re liable to meet all types of people at our next favorite issue rally. In a way, it’s so divided it’s now merging.

  44. Lake Lady says:

    I have read that Gates has wanted to end some of the hugely expensive airplane(F22) programs for a long time. If you read up on it the connection between the military brass and the contractors is insidious.Retired generals take jobs with the contracting firms as soon as they retire and spend the years before retiring feathering the nest they are going to move to post retirement. BTW Ann…I checked out RCP and did not find any articles about Obama written by Europeans..am I looking in the wrong place?

  45. Lake Lady says:

    bbl

  46. GeoT says:

    Lake Lady says:
    06 April 2009 at 2:08 pm

    . BTW Ann…I checked out RCP and did not find any articles about Obama written by Europeans..am I looking in the wrong place?
    _____

    no Ann is just making stuff up again… she fits “facts” to match her fantasy. But that’s why we love her ;)

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